Flipper.tool NFT project grant request

Hey tommy, I am glad we are on the same page here.

The devs actually aren’t external, we found them through the developers guild and they are all DAO members.

The WL for DAO members is something I am thinking about - it’s not that hard to implement, but it might be something that slows the initial growth. I am not really a fan of whitelists, because most of them is dumping it later on secondary - not saying this will be the case. If have any other benefits on mind, we would like to hear them!

Sure, we can do milestones, but we are approx. 2-3 weeks from rolling out the MVP and mint (we started building immediately) - I don’t feel like there are many milestones left before the MVP, but again if you feel otherwise and think that the milestone would help, then I am open to the idea!

We already have some significant milestones behind us from the dev perspective, I guess we should have shared them in the proposal.

I see a lot of concerns about the lack of tangible results, high risk for the DAO, and the expectation of a timeline and milestones. To put you at ease, here’s an overview of the work done up until now and expectations for the following weeks:

Scope of the MVP:

We’re set on the scope of the MVP: It will be an NFT sniping tool with the unique proposition of estimating the pricing of tokens based on rarity rank and past sales after the reveal and helping traders take action on it quickly to sweep underpriced NFTs and to sell their own at an appropriate value while there’s enough volume and liquidity on the collection.

This is the concept mockup (Better UI over bellow, I’m not a designer :joy:):

Price estimation:
The idea for the price estimation (purple line) is to do a regression based on the pricing of OpenSea sales of the collection and on a rarity score estimation of each token (we’ll be using the same methodology from rarity.tools, and will be able to estimate it before the official collection rarity reveal). This will allow traders to get a quick estimate of how much their tokens are worth, helping price them accordingly, and also to get an overview of existing listings and how much underpriced or overpriced they are.

Bulk orders
All the existing tools for NFT trading rely on interfaces that are not optimized to do a bunch of trades fast. A good deal of them provides a browser extension that layers some extra functionality on top of OpenSea’s website, which is optimized to buy a single NFT at a time, while the others don’t even have any feature to facilitate orders, just taking the user to OS.

We’ll have a bulk orders feature to streamline the buying, listing, and offering of NFTs without having to get out of our tool. The idea is to let the user pick a bunch of orders he wants to make using our price x rarity chart and then execute all those orders at once, signing the bunch of them at once.

  • Buying will be easy as the user can find good deals by looking for NFTs that are underpriced for their estimated rarity score, so he can pick the ones he wants (peeking over them by hovering, if he’s interested in the aesthetics) and select a bunch to buy.
  • Listing will also be optimal because the user can see the estimated price of each of his NFTs and quickly drag it to list for sale at an appropriate price, considering past sales and existing listings for NFTs of close rarity.
  • Finally, there will be the option to make bulk offers to try and grab NFTs at a lower price than the estimated one (like: offer 20% under predicted price for the top 5% rarer ones) which can be really effective because the offer will probably be over the floor price, and people without tooling for rarity and pricing estimation will see it as a good deal.

Current development status:
We’ve made a bunch of Proof of Concepts for the many components of this solution and are now integrating all of them into a working prototype so we can figure out what works and what doesn’t (like exploring collections of different sizes and seeing how that fits on the chart, figuring out the regression methodology that gives the best fit with the data, and so on) and iterate on the design.

Stuff we already crossed off the list:

  • OS listing and sales scraping
  • price prediction with regression techniques
  • metadata scraping
  • rarity estimation
  • performant charting lib

Here’s my current playground :sweat_smile: :

Also, we already have a designer working on making something beautiful out of my scribbles:


Yeah, our mascot is a dolphin :dolphin:

So we’re building this already, the release is planned for at most early December, and we’ve already hit the point of having most of the risks minimized (we know we can deliver this). Also, @DavidBankless, @Gecko007, and @yacht_tea_Ed are deeply involved with NFT trading communities and are active users of basically all of the existing tools, and can vouch for how our’s have a unique feature set and how it’s incredibly valuable in this niche.

That being said, IMHO the risks for this grant are pretty minimal for the DAO, and far outweighed by the upside: Investment returned in 3 months, and then ongoing returns for the lifetime of the project. Also, this is based on a pretty conservative estimation of secondary returns.

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for anybody still having doubts about this project please check out @volky 's reply to this post.

We can make another post to make all of this more clear. As stated in the poll as well, this is our first such experience with BanklessDAO being on the side of makers/creators.

Also, please do give open feedback so we can improve and make this project a benefit and revenue stream for the dao.

Thanks David. You answered most of my questions with only 1 left.
How about a detail development plan and Go-To-Market plan? or a milestone based plan that @tommyolofsson mentioned.

@volky prvoides more detail about feature, i like it. I can see you guys have passion on your product and i agree what Volky said 375K BANK is not really a big money for such a project.

Since this project is a commerial project and with only 10% secordary market income relates to DAO Treasury, i still consider this as an external project. All team members comes from BDAO doesn’t means it is a BDAO internal project. To be considerred as an internal project ,there should be more connections between project itself and DAO. There is no measure criteria to tell us what is a internal Project and what is not. But the criterial in my mind tell me it is not, for now.

But people should be able to work with each other to pursuit their own interest and business success. Which is really not a problem IMO. So to me, it doesn’t matter it is an internal project or external project, i am supportive with a good execution plan.

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Gentlemen. I’m digging the energy you have put into the proposal and discussion. Your MVP details have pushed me to vote yes. I really appreciate that you guys are already putting in the work and building something.

A couple of thoughts and questions…

This does feel like an external project. Perhaps there are some lessons to be learned from the recent DAOpunks launch. It was a revenue generator and also a HYPE generator. People were excited, and that community engagement resulted in fantastic marketing and a successful project. Perhaps a whitelist or discount for DAO members would help those of us not directly involved in this project feel connected to it.

How do you plan to get the word out about your mint? Who specifically are you marketing to and how do you plan to engage with them? Are you trying to sell mints to DAO members or targeting other communities? We’ve all seen mints that didn’t sell well and projects that were awesome but never achieved escape velocity. I’d love to hear you thoughts on how to blast this into the marketplace

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There’s a lot of questions and I need to read through them to see what’s been answered.

At first thought, the revenue part seems potentially reasonable, but I’m wondering if this should be reclassified as a project within the DAO. If it is seeking funding for an external project or team, it might be most beneficial to list on the Gitcoin Grants for public goods? is t

One way that I could see this having a tangible benefit for the DAO would be access for anyone who meets the Level 1 requirements, so having 35,000 BANK in the wallet would grant any bDAO member the ability to use the service. So, anyone could subscribe using the NFT model to obtain access, and if anyone held 35k bank. It would seem reasonable to also have 1-2 bDAO wallets as signers on the multisig. So if there’s five total, two would be from the DAO.

If this was to pass, I’d also want to see funds disbursed upon completion of goals instead of a lump sum pre-paid. If it was to be pre-paid, I would think having a majority of bDAO signers on the account would be reasonable.

But at that point, why not just come back into the fold and have it as a project in the DAO that anyone can help with. I haven’t read the threads that were linked, and obviously any one is free to do whatever they want and work on anything they want, but if it was a recruitment from the DAO talent pool, perhaps the DAO would pay the devs and then the project would either put bounties up or pay the DAO for the consultation services as such.

Regardless, I definitely love the concept and would be stoked to see this get created! It might just be optimal to migrate it back into the DAO as a project instead of it being an external funding/grant request?

I’ll read through more of the comments and responses more when it isn’t so late. Cheers!

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Just wanted to say thank you for including this explanation. It definitely makes the project feel more credible.

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Hi ZrowGz,

I don’t quite understand your comment, our whole team is bankless DAO team, I guess it’s not that clear from our proposal, we will work on that.

Can you explain more what you mean by pre-paid?

Regarding bdao signers, as mentioned all of us are bdao. Regarding help, anyone willing to help is more than welcome, this is the core team that put this together and we are asking for a grant just like any other project inside bankless dao.

I’ve got a few questions too!!

  1. What’s stopping competitors (Freshdrops, Curio, etc) from building the signature feature?
  2. What’s stopping corporations (OpenSea, Coinbase) from building tools like this? I’d assume it’s gotta be on their roadmaps?
  3. If #2 above is true, then will this NFT tool live on forever or is this a short term project?

Personally I feel that the market is a little saturated for another tool right now, but I do love the signature feature.

i really feel folks should do more education within the dao about their proposals, I don’t even have the fundamental understandings of how something like this might work so cannot vote for it.

Most of the existing tools offer a browser extension that adds some functionality on top of OpenSea’s interface. They do that so they can use the restricted GraphQL API (only accepts requests coming from opensea’s domain, uses CloudFlare to prevent scraping/back-end access) and bypass the limitations of the REST API.

To have an interface like ours they would have to build it from scratch, and pivot considerably from their existing offering, so that’s to our advantage. Also, the data we’re gathering isn’t easily available from the API, so the scraping solutions we’re building (mainly for listings, which are off-chain and live on OS’s infrastructure) are not so trivial to copy, and our team’s skillset is to our advantage (: (we have some good experience building data scraping/aggregation systems like this)

Nothing is stopping them from doing something similar, but we’ll have a clear first-mover advantage going with this design. Also, our main strength is the idea of providing clear insights instead of data dumps, and this feature won’t be our single bet.

I don’t think it makes much sense for them to build something like this, especially at the moment (Look at how Opensea is having a hard-time scaling). Those platforms focus on providing the space for an ecosystem to grow, and building niche tools like this shouldn’t be so aligned with their strategies…at least not while they have their core competency and all the expansion to L2s to worry about.

Even if/when they do, they would favor their own datasets, and we’re heading for a much more fragmented market share on NFT marketplaces (Look at Zora, Shoyu, Genie, and Coinbase itself coming p…Opensea won’t be an undisputed leader for much longer). As a standalone product, we’ll be positioned to add compatibility with all of those marketplaces, which is a big value-added for traders.

We’re going for the long run.

What I presented above is just the MVP. From there we’ll keep adding new features, always following our motto of “Clear, actionable insights”, which really puts our product on a different paradigm from the existing tools, that favor having as much data as possible and fall prey to having a low signal/noise ratio.

The follow-up feature will possibly be NFT portfolio management, leveraging our price by rarity prediction to get more accurate net worth estimations and to notify users proactively when their assets have significant shifts in valuation.

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I think we shouldn’t expect everyone to have a say on everything that goes on in the DAO…it’s already hard enough to keep track of our main interests and circles of competence while being firehosed with everything that is going on at a fast pace, so I don’t think many people will have the time to dive deep and educate themselves on every single proposal. There will always be some informal delegation of votes to people whom we trust and who are comfortable enough with the proposal’s subject to raise most of the concerns and move the debate.

We’re tackling a pretty niche project over here, so I would expect most feedback from #nft-club and @NFT Connoisseurs, with TL;DRs and ELI5s on demand to make it easier to digest for everyone else (ask away, people. #no-stupid-questions :slight_smile: )

I have voted no for now because I feel like this proposal should be re-submitted with a much clearer milestone-based compensation structure and better alignment with BDAO incentives.

Tool looks cool and useful but this should:
a) Pay higher on-going tribute and royalties to BDAO, more in the region of 30% since we would be financing your entire start-up journey, there is little to no entrepreneurial risk
b) give BANK holders benefits like pre-mint / access to the tool

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These are great changes and would likely make this project more attractive to the entire DAO.

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We will take all these concerns and make a beter proposal :slight_smile: thank you guys

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Hi volky, many of us are IN the NFT club.

We have to be mindful that there are many in the DAO who have never done NFTs, and some minted DAO punks as their very first NFT.

So we definitely should start running more DAO wide education efforts to help us understand more about NFTs.

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Yeah, that makes sense. I think that would be more like an ongoing effort than a single shot at educating about this specific proposal.

We could definitely work on educational material in a partnership between Flipper’s team and BDAO as the project matures.

Moving to archive. Please reply to reopen.